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Thanks for listening Irish.
Old 05-04-2012, 10:22 AM   #1
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Default Thanks for listening Irish.

One issue that some of us have discussed off line here and agreed on....is that scheme aside ......we need to get more athletic..the last two drafts have absolutely been geared in that direction...but one thing past that bothered those of us that have chatted off line.....the need to "get smarter"......mission accomplished.


We needed team guys that work and that do not beat their wives and kick the shit out of cats for fun.....see ya Brandon.......best of luck Igor.....say hello to cell block C Mr. Merling.........not sure I would want to be Koa Misi right about now...and Jerome Messam better not even stick gum on a desk or his butt will be gone before he gets a chance to prove he can beat the shit out of a lot of people.

We have lamented the general dipshit play of some players...and it is not hard to go back and tie together Rashard Jones 14 wonderlic, Chris Clemmons 15, Benny Sapps 11, Daniel Thomas being dumb as dogshit, and John Jerry's 8 (my freakin dog scored a 10...........) and some of the other documented brain surgeons on this team with their on field brain farts and their slow development...Tony Sparano's complete inept teaching aside.

Look at this year....

RT1.....smart kid...
Martin a Stanford grad with 3.7........
Egnew...smart guy....
Olivier Vernon....kick ass smart.......
Lamar Miller..played as a frosh because he picked the system up so well, universally known as a "bright kid".
Josh Kaddu.....cerebral player according to most..out of control as all hell but smart....
BJ Cunningham...very smart player...
Kheeston Randall..all around great kid, spends incredible amount of time in the community and was an outstanding student...high character smart kid.
Rishard Matthews...military kid, graduated JC in 1.5 years, citizen award winner...high end kid.

My impression is that Irish is versatile in getting what his staff want in players and clearly I think character and intelligence were involved in the evaluations......i personally see this as a very overlooked issue prior to the arrival of Joe Philbin and I think this will serve us well.

This is starting to feel professional and like someone has a FN clue IMHO.

Last edited by my 2 cents; 05-04-2012 at 10:57 AM..
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Old 05-04-2012, 10:51 AM   #2
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I understand that you don't want to get a player with character issue but that doesn't mean that you neglect getting good players. I not saying this draft was bad because I think he did well but at the same time you have to do what best to win even if that player has character issue.
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Old 05-04-2012, 11:10 AM   #3
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Originally Posted by Finfavorite25 View Post
I understand that you don't want to get a player with character issue but that doesn't mean that you neglect getting good players. I not saying this draft was bad because I think he did well but at the same time you have to do what best to win even if that player has character issue.
I understand what you are saying and there is a balance and tipping point.

In my experiences building organizations structurally even if they are on a relative small scale, you try and change or create a mentality with the least amount of effort and with the least amount of direct mandates because "mentality" is an arbitrary issue and subtle.

Character is a trait.....work ethic is a trait, intelligence is a trait.....when you subtly and with breadth in your organization put enough of these "traits" together then you end up with mentality that is sustainable.....IMHO THAT is why organizations like the Steelers and Pats are consistent...they have a lot of people with a lot of the same traits that make them sustainable....it is also IMO why organizations like The Raiders went downhill so far so fast when Al Davis became less of a control mechanism.

But back to paragraph 2...sometimes in order to break a mentality you have to kill a gnat with a sledgehammer...meaning you go overboard for a while and overcompensate relative to your "tipping point". I think that is what they are doing here.

Two years from now when you have a guy that has a 72.9 with some character concerns....or a 69.4 guy with great character...maybe two years from now because you went overboard on character your locker room is strong enough to police itself and you can take a chance on the 72.9 guy that got a rooster pregnant and skinned a cat in high school.

I have a basic understanding I think of what they are trying to do on the field, but I have a clear understanding of what they are trying to do off the field and the type player they want on the field...from passing on Flynn to letting Marshall go, cutting Merling..it makes sense to me.

I really feel good about this organization "getting it" and being consistent and maintaining their plan...this is a cerebral group with teachers, management guys, evaluators all doing their rolls, and it really" feels like" they will not make a move out of desperation or outside their box...and over the long haul it will work......frustrating initially because we as fans want quick fixes, we want the Peyton Manning s, Matt Flynn's and RG3's..........

Last edited by my 2 cents; 05-04-2012 at 11:13 AM..
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Old 05-04-2012, 05:19 PM   #4
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The very FIRST rule, the GOLDEN rule if you will, of a great oganization ... He/She must be a good team mate!

Only smart, high character people will give you that type person. You find these people in all walks of life, it matters not where you were born, the color of your skin, the fullness of your bank account, or the amount of book learning pasted on your wall. Class is from the heart and it starts from the very top!

Very telling that we had to clean out the fish smell to get a breath of fresh air, self discipline, and accountability to start showing up in house! The openness and accountability is quite refreshing!

Thank you Stephen Ross, Jeff Ireland, and Joe Philbin for this wonderful beginning of a great turnaround!
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Last edited by Intrepid FinFan; 05-04-2012 at 05:21 PM..
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Old 05-04-2012, 06:21 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by my 2 cents View Post
I understand what you are saying and there is a balance and tipping point.

In my experiences building organizations structurally even if they are on a relative small scale, you try and change or create a mentality with the least amount of effort and with the least amount of direct mandates because "mentality" is an arbitrary issue and subtle.

Character is a trait.....work ethic is a trait, intelligence is a trait.....when you subtly and with breadth in your organization put enough of these "traits" together then you end up with mentality that is sustainable.....IMHO THAT is why organizations like the Steelers and Pats are consistent...they have a lot of people with a lot of the same traits that make them sustainable....it is also IMO why organizations like The Raiders went downhill so far so fast when Al Davis became less of a control mechanism.

But back to paragraph 2...sometimes in order to break a mentality you have to kill a gnat with a sledgehammer...meaning you go overboard for a while and overcompensate relative to your "tipping point". I think that is what they are doing here.

Two years from now when you have a guy that has a 72.9 with some character concerns....or a 69.4 guy with great character...maybe two years from now because you went overboard on character your locker room is strong enough to police itself and you can take a chance on the 72.9 guy that got a rooster pregnant and skinned a cat in high school.

I have a basic understanding I think of what they are trying to do on the field, but I have a clear understanding of what they are trying to do off the field and the type player they want on the field...from passing on Flynn to letting Marshall go, cutting Merling..it makes sense to me.

I really feel good about this organization "getting it" and being consistent and maintaining their plan...this is a cerebral group with teachers, management guys, evaluators all doing their rolls, and it really" feels like" they will not make a move out of desperation or outside their box...and over the long haul it will work......frustrating initially because we as fans want quick fixes, we want the Peyton Manning s, Matt Flynn's and RG3's..........
Another advantage of getting your character guys now (besides building the culture) is that later, if you do take a partial douchebag because of his high ability, these character guys will be vets and will tell the kid to tow the line.
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Old 05-05-2012, 06:31 AM   #6
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I agree with what Ron has outlined, and I STRONGLY agree with what DN has added in regards to the smart, mature tribe taking care of any problem children that might arrive due to talent and need, but sorry, the Wonderlic as an indicator is absolute BS!!!!

The rest I do think talks volumes to where the team is headed, and yes it is very good to see.

One thing I do know though, when Parsnips first got here, a pattern we saw was that the majority of the kids they started accumulating were indeed Team Captains and such. I think that also ties into the same mindset, although I do know that just cause they are team captains doesn't mean they are either smart or good people.......
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Old 05-06-2012, 12:56 AM   #7
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but sorry, the Wonderlic as an indicator is absolute BS!!!!
That is your opinion and you are entitled to it...but I disagree and I think over time it has been a great indicator.
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